Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

From the Singapore and Southampton through to the Short Empire

Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby fredgell » Tue Nov 05, 2013 6:39 pm

Not strictly quite the right place to post this - but if you've not found this yet

Short S.23 'Empire', film taken in 1937 on Sumba
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1rQ9Tlu72c

In colour!

Enjoy

Fred
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Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby longshot » Wed Nov 06, 2013 12:13 am

That looks like Imperial's G-AETW Calpurnia which had done a fly-by at pre-war Heathrow and was lost Lake Habbaniyah, Iraq, Nov 1938. Looks like bare metal to me.....Mick
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Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby Philthy » Wed Nov 06, 2013 12:22 am

Interesting that it's said to be Sumba in 1937.

For one thing, the flying boat service beyond Singapore did not commence until 1938. For another, Sumba was never on the regular route.

Some research required, obviously...
Aeradio Operator John G. 'Johnnie' Walker, Karumba Flying Boat Base, 1938.
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Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby Philthy » Thu Nov 07, 2013 8:30 am

I'm with Mick - it does look like Calpurnia.

My money is on Bima, Sumbawa, in 1938.

It appears that Calpurnia made only two trips to Australia (i.e. east of Singapore). These were: SE3/SW4, at Bima on 7 & 18 August 1938 respectively; and SE24/SW25, at Bima on 27 September and 6 October respectively. There is no evidence that I can find of any diversion to Sumba.

As Mick pointed out, Calpurnia was destroyed at Habbaniyah on 27 November 1938, operating CE80.
Aeradio Operator John G. 'Johnnie' Walker, Karumba Flying Boat Base, 1938.
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Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby Silentflyer » Mon Nov 25, 2013 10:48 pm

Interesting shots of AMA. These look to be pretty untouched original colour photos to me, despite being badly faded. Philthy, I am sure that you are right about the Imperial Airways Empire boats, but I am not so convinced that the NZ boats were silver. There are just too many people that remember them as white, not to mention the reply that I got back from MOTAT in Auckland, which although they didnt give a conclusive answer, hinted again that they thought they were coloured white, possibly some time after they arrived in NZ (who knows, but perfectly plausable.)

Regardless, I feel that the evidence for the NZ Empire boats is enough to go for a white on the model that I have commissioned, with the colour scheme as it was at the time of AMA being broken up. White certainly was the colour scheme of all of TEALS aircraft after the war, and it looks pretty white to me in the photos here.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/waynesart/3224437209/
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Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby PaulM » Mon Mar 24, 2014 7:22 am

Hi,
I am almost finished building the Empire at scale 1:16 and I am wondering whether anybody knows the correct colour of the marking/identification of the aircraft in the 30ties. :?:
https://plus.google.com/photos/10778246 ... p6CC5uS4XA

Regards Paul
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Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby longshot » Thu Mar 27, 2014 1:23 pm

There's still argument whether the lettering was dark blue or black on Imperial Empire boats. Here's a message on Wings of Peace forum from Bill Matthews

"A couple of days ago I got hold of my friend Adrian Constable, who works in the BA archive, and asked him for info on the colouring of the letters of the Short Empires. It turns out that it is more complicated than it seems to be. The standard colour of these in the days of Imperial Airways was dark blue, but Adrian has found that, though the letters on the five D.H. Albatross airliners were blue (a non-standard colour brighter than Imperial's usual blue), the two freighters G-AEVV and 'VW had black letters. He suspects that the two transatlantic Empires G-ADHM Caledonia and 'DUV Cambria, whose interiors had been stripped, also had black letters. All the airline Empires flown by Imperial had dark blue letters. Incidentally, Empires were covered in anodised aluminium which I've heard described as both cream and light grey, and not in natural metal. With the outbreak of WW II, all Empires were camouflaged, not at first to a standard pattern - that came later. When the camouflage was removed in 1944 - 5, the letters were painted in black - probably because it was readily available. Since they were scrapped soon after the war, presumably they kept their black letters until they were broken up. Adrian also believes that the Hythes (converted Sunderlands) had black letters, but the Solents reverted to dark blue.
Bill M"

Perhaps compromise and use the darkest blue available [with some more black added :-)] Mick
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Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby PaulM » Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:27 am

Thanks for posting Mick !
I will use the dark blue colour as the story of Bill telling us that Short Brothers used that colour in the 33ties anyway. ;)

Regards Paul
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Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby Bart83 » Sat Mar 29, 2014 9:00 am

Hi Paul ,

Take a look at this colour film from the 1930's ;)

[youtube]Y0OUK6iNUXo[/youtube]
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Re: Short Empire hull colours - an article of interest...?

Postby dogsbody » Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:12 pm

The link doesn't work. Could you please re-post?



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with a uniform to wear,
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